Nutritional Deficiency?

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Banadoura
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Nutritional Deficiency?

#1

Post: # 12292Unread post Banadoura
Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:10 pm

Hi All,

It appears I ran across not one, but multiple nutrient deficiencies :(

Please note that the room temp is 21 C (70 F)
A fan runs at least 8 hours a day, level 1 setting
I don't think I have an over/under watering issue, I suspect nutrient deficiency

This Maglia Rosa plant was transplanted on Feb-8, I only started fertilizing on Feb-24 (floranova grow)
Any idea what the yellow spots mean?
Image

Another bottom leaf from a different Maglia Rosa plant
Image

This Kimberley is a recent transplant, about a week ago
It is exhibiting purple color on the bottom of the leaf, never been fertilized yet
Image

This tiny Tim was transplanted on February 2nd, it grew nicely and is about to flower
However, the bottom leafs moving up are dying. Fertilizing only began on feb-24 (after symptoms appeared)
Image

Anyone experienced this? I have Vilma and Jolacho that were started the same time as Tiny Tim and they are super happy.

Thanks!

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#2

Post: # 12294Unread post MissS
Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:43 pm

Banadoura I think that you have a few things going on.
Your first plant is showing signs of septoria with the presence of those circular marks. It appears that the dry dots are developing in yellowed areas of your leaves. It is hard to tell from this photo if the yellowing is due to lack of nitrogen or if it is of a fungal nature, perhaps early blight. Whichever, remove the affected leaves, feed with a balanced fertilizer (in the future I would start feeding your plants sooner) and use a fungicide as directed. I think that the same type of issue is starting on your second Maglia Rose.
The Kimberly has a phosphorus deficiency which it will out grow once fed. This is displayed by the purple leaf and stem. It also may be showing the start of a nitrogen deficiency in that new leaf that is emerging.
Your Tiny Tim I am not so sure of. My first guess was over fertilizing but that is not the case. It could be too close to the lights and high heat or from wet leaves. I'm sure someone else will chime in.
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

dfollett
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#3

Post: # 12315Unread post dfollett
Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:25 am

MissS wrote:
Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:43 pm
Your Tiny Tim I am not so sure of. My first guess was over fertilizing but that is not the case. It could be too close to the lights and high heat or from wet leaves. I'm sure someone else will chime in.
What are the signs of over fertilizing?

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brownrexx
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#4

Post: # 12332Unread post brownrexx
Sat Feb 29, 2020 8:47 am

The purple leaves are a sign of a phosphorus deficiency BUT that can be caused by low temperatures. Tomato plants can not absorb phosphorus at low temperatures even if it is present. I usually don't worry about purple leaves or stems. They will green up once the weather warms up and they are outside.

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Banadoura
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#5

Post: # 12339Unread post Banadoura
Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:30 am

Thanks MissS, transplanted 6 seedlings today and I started low dosage fertilizing to see if I can avoid similar problems.

Re Septoria,is it possible to get it when growing inside? It's a fungus, can it lay dormant in seeds?

Tiny Tim is 12 inches tall, canopy is 2-3 inches from the lights. Would being too close stunt the growth?

Thanks Brownrexx, temp is stable at 70F. Maybe some ferts will help.

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Bower
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#6

Post: # 12344Unread post Bower
Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:51 am

The Tiny Tim looks like damage I've seen on plants when they first go outdoors here in the sun and wind.
I'm not sure what relative humidity tomatoes prefer, but the low RH indoors in winter is a challenge for leafy crops. The only way I can get close to the RH that lettuce prefers is by keeping temperature low - closer to 60 F. In a warmer room the RH is much lower, and the fan would contribute to dry out the leaves, that is if you let the soil get too dry.
I think at 70F you would want to keep the soil pretty moist ( vs not watering much at all, when temps are in the low 60s).
So I would guess that plant has rather thin and delicate leaves which are now toast due to a drying stress event. They won't revive from that condition, and moister environment will only help them rot. You should take scissors and clip off all the necrotic edges, and the living part of the leaf can recover and do its job until it grows some new ones.
AgCan Zone 5a/USDA zone 4
temperate marine climate
yearly precip 61 inches/1550 mm

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#7

Post: # 12346Unread post MissS
Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:11 am

You are correct in using a low dosage fertilizer too much can harm those tender roots. I use a mix at 50% of the suggested dose and I usually will add a pinch of Epsom salts to the mix to avoid a magnesium deficiency.

Septoria is a fungus. Fungus spores are everywhere and just need the right opportunity to grow, inside or out. Molds tend to grow when it is warm and humid with poor air movement and do their best growing indoors in greenhouse conditions. The best treatment is prevention. Keep the leaves dry and use a fan for air circulation. The above condition could also be Bacterial Spot but your leaves seem to have more yellowing which is why I chose Septoria. The treatment is the same for both.

It is hard for me to say about Tiny Tim. How hot is it under those lights? Where the leaves ever wet and then left in the direct light to perhaps burn? Try moving the plant to the edge of the table and see if that helps it recover. Please do remove those damaged leaves though.

I am also wondering what the undersides of your plants leaves look like?
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#8

Post: # 12350Unread post MissS
Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:20 am

dfollett wrote:
Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:25 am
MissS wrote:
Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:43 pm
Your Tiny Tim I am not so sure of. My first guess was over fertilizing but that is not the case. It could be too close to the lights and high heat or from wet leaves. I'm sure someone else will chime in.
What are the signs of over fertilizing?
Over fertilizing of young plants displays itself differently than large plants. Over fertilizing can easily burn the young tender roots which would then prevent the uptake of moisture and nutrients. One sign can be very dark green leaves with spindly growth. The leaves will then dry up and become crackly on the edges much like the photo above of Tiny Tim.

If the roots are severely burnt then you can have yellowing of the leaves with spindly and droopy plants that look like they need feeding. Eventually the leaves will wither,brown and dry up.
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

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Banadoura
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#9

Post: # 12777Unread post Banadoura
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:32 pm

An update on what I've been seeing on my table

One of the Maglia Rosa plants today had a vine with very yellow leaves. So weird as I watered them yesterday or the day before with water that has 0.5tsp of epsom salts (in 1.75L of water) as well as light fertilizer. The only thing that comes to mind now is that I am not watering well enough?

Image

Another Maglia Rosa is showing a beginning of yellowing, notice the middle of the leaf:
Image

the Tiny Tim is a lost cause....look at the bottom leaves, I kept it to see how it will evolve:
Image

Tomorrow it'll probably snap easily.

The top of Tiny Tim:
Image

You clearly see flowers and the leaves curling inwards. The edges are changing color, preparing to dry out.

My temp is around 70F, I might have started to fertilize later but I did start back on the 24th. Humidity is between 42% and 48%. I do water every few days when the top soil dries. I have a fan running 8 hours a day.

So far, Maglia Rosa, Not Purple Strawbery and Tiny Tim are iffy. Maglia and NPS have leafs curling inwards, they're not happy. TinyTim is throwing a Tantrum.
On the other hand, I have Carbon, Kimberley, ISPL, Madera, Jolacho and Vilma all doing great (so far). Vilma and Jolacho (3 plants in total) are about to flower with not a dot of color out of the ordinary.

Now that's confusing!

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#10

Post: # 12781Unread post MissS
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:44 pm

Darn. I still can't figure out what is going on with your Tiny Tim. Can you pull it out of it's pot and inspect the roots? I'm wondering if there is something going on down there that we can't see. Of course, I'm fishing on this one. Does anyone else know what this is?

Your other plants have been without nutrients for awhile and they will most likely need another feeding before they pick up. If they are still on the dry side then go ahead and feed them again until they are moist throughout. You could even increase the dose of ferts a little more but withhold adding anymore Epsom salts.
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#11

Post: # 12783Unread post MissS
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:45 pm

I forgot to say that that yellow leaf is too far gone to save. Just pull it off and move on.
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

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Banadoura
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#12

Post: # 12786Unread post Banadoura
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:56 pm

Thanks for sharing your thoughts MissS, I will increase the fert dosage for my next watering.

Yup, the yellow vine is coming off.

I want to see how far TinyTim will go, will check the roots postmortem :)

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MissS
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Re: Nutritional Deficiency?

#13

Post: # 12794Unread post MissS
Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:40 pm

Banadoura, I did post some good information about diagnosing your plants issues. Take a look and see if you see something that looks similar to what your Tiny Tim has.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=392
Enjoy the Day!
~ Patti ~

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