So many things going wrong!

Shrinkrap
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So many things going wrong!

#1

Post: # 29492Unread post Shrinkrap
Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:32 pm

I am assuming these tomato plants are doomed, but if anyone knows what this is, I’d love to know.

Don’t remember seeing anything quite like it before, although I have seen dry, crispy leaves at the bottom of plants.

What was different most recently was hotter than usual temps, during which there was a little bit of precipitation, and then fires. The plants weren’t touched by the fire, and this started just before the fire, but there are lots of ashes on them.

While the leaves on the different plants vary from dark grey to pale yellow, none are wilting, and most of the damage is at the bottom and center of the plant.

At first I thought it was spider mites, but now I’m assuming it is several things, including fungal, and I rarely have fungal problems. I’m guessing late blight? Someone has also identified spiralizing whitefly.There are also ashes from a recent fire.
Oh, well. The peppers seem okay, and i guess ican make room for a September planting
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Nan6b
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#2

Post: # 29500Unread post Nan6b
Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:29 pm

Welcome to the Junction, Shrinkrap!
Sorry to hear about your plants. I do think you have more than one thing going on with them. I would take off all the leaves that are yellow, gray, or brown. They are not producing chlorophyll and therefore aren't doing any good for the plant. They are just a place for disease to sit.

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peebee
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#3

Post: # 29501Unread post peebee
Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:30 pm

Sorry to see the condition of your plants [mention]Shrinkrap[/mention]. If it was spider mites you would've seen lots of very fine webbing by now, with the leaves that dry and crinkly. No wilting is a good sign. Remove the damaged leaves and see what happens. Hope they recover.
Someone here might have more insight as to what is wrong.
Zone 10, Southern California
Will eat anything once before I judge.
Anything meaning any foods of course.

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Ginger2778
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#4

Post: # 29506Unread post Ginger2778
Mon Aug 31, 2020 4:31 am

It's mites. I think it's most likely Tomato Russet Mites. I treat mine with Abamectin. They love to overwinter in Earthboxes and other containers. Abamectin is costly, but you only use 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of water. So not really costly after all.
If you have a microscope or a 14X magnification, you can see them.
- Marsha

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bower
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#5

Post: # 29511Unread post bower
Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:19 am

Hi Shrinkrap! I'm betting that Ginger is right. I also agree with the advice to remove all discolored and wilted leaves. Pests and disease often go hand in hand. I see a few spots there that look like classic Early Blight, which may be setting in on leaves that are insect damaged. If there were no pests, I would advise to fertilize too after removing the bad leaves, but in some types of pest infestation fertilizing can make it worse (I've read). So it might be best to wait until the pests have been purged, before you add anything with high N, iirc.
AgCan Zone 5a/USDA zone 4
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yearly precip 61 inches/1550 mm

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peebee
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#6

Post: # 29533Unread post peebee
Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:29 am

By whitefly is that what I see in the top right hand corner of the 2nd pic? Is that the same pest on the bottom of the leaf in the last photo? I never knew they could infest tomatoes. I usually see them on my fruit trees. Yes it does seem you have more than 1 issue. Give us an update later, hopefully resolved.
Zone 10, Southern California
Will eat anything once before I judge.
Anything meaning any foods of course.

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Ginger2778
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#7

Post: # 29540Unread post Ginger2778
Mon Aug 31, 2020 1:01 pm

peebee wrote: Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:29 am By whitefly is that what I see in the top right hand corner of the 2nd pic? Is that the same pest on the bottom of the leaf in the last photo? I never knew they could infest tomatoes. I usually see them on my fruit trees. Yes it does seem you have more than 1 issue. Give us an update later, hopefully resolved.
Correct on the whiteflies, but that's in addition to the OP's real problem, which is (Tomato Russet) mites.
BTW the type of whitefly that causes trouble in tomatoes isn't the spiral, but rather it's the Silverleaf Whitefly. The Silverleaf ones transmit Tomato Yellow Leaf Curl Virus, always an incurable tragedy. What the OP shows is spiral whiteflies, not so bad.
There's also some early blight, but that's not the real killer here.
- Marsha

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peebee
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#8

Post: # 29554Unread post peebee
Mon Aug 31, 2020 3:16 pm

[mention]Ginger2778[/mention] good to learn about the different whiteflies. I hope I'll never see the silverleaf kind here.
I started to see spider mites in my garden around the end of July/early August but they seemed to have dwindled off even though I didn't do anything. Which is a relief and my tomatoes started producing again albeit much smaller in size.
Definitely going to look into this Abamectin. Thanks!
Zone 10, Southern California
Will eat anything once before I judge.
Anything meaning any foods of course.

MsCowpea
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#9

Post: # 29589Unread post MsCowpea
Mon Aug 31, 2020 8:31 pm

The thing is , be careful as Abamectin is very toxic to bees. There is no window of safe spraying (I.e. spraying at dusk, early morning, or whatever) IF the plant has blooms. They say you are not even supposed to let it drift unto weeds that are flowering. Always check your specific formulation for restrictions. Added: One good thing “Does not harm natural enemies” . (UCANR)

Toxicity to humans doesn’t worry me as unsafe exposure is highly unlikely but bees need protecting 🐝 .

https://www2.ipm.ucanr.edu/beeprecaution/

Just choose ‘acaricide’ under ‘all types’ and use the drop down to find what you want.

http://ipm.ucanr.edu/TOOLS/PNAI/pnaishow.php?id=4

Peebee, correct me if I am wrong but I have read about your awful russet mites in Calif. and it seems that type of mite doesn’t have the. webbing. At least , It is never mentioned in the identification characteristics. Do they also have the webbing? That would help to ID if it pertains to russet mites as well.

Shrink wrap. I have never had to deal with mites that required any intervention. Be sure and confirm ID. I would be sorely tempted to enclose the whole plant (if it was pretty much decimated by them) in a garbage bag and get rid of it. But before I put the garbage bag over the plant I would spray with canned cooking oil spray just to keep them from moving or blowing off. Then I could work on saving any other plants that were worth saving.
Last edited by MsCowpea on Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:44 am, edited 4 times in total.
"When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work."
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Shrinkrap
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#10

Post: # 29597Unread post Shrinkrap
Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:51 pm

Oops. Messing up already!
Last edited by Shrinkrap on Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Shrinkrap
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#11

Post: # 29598Unread post Shrinkrap
Mon Aug 31, 2020 10:52 pm

Thank you all so much! What an amazing welcome. Someone on another forum said I would find some answers here and they were right! I will try to return the favor.

BTW, I am in Northern California half way between San Francisco and Sacramento.

So far I've removed most of the damaged leaves, fertilized with earthworm something or other, sprayed with neemv oil after dusk yesterday, and with dilute bleach this evening. Hope I'm not making it worse, but that seems hard to do. I must say I've had a pretty good up until now.

BTW, I think the white in the second picture is ashes from the fire. It was pretty bad.
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I haven't wanted to spray off the ashes because I wa ttoavkidwetting the leaves. They do make the spider mite webs easierto see, and there didn't appear to be enough to explain all the damage.
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peebee
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#12

Post: # 29605Unread post peebee
Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:31 am

Whoa your last pic says it all. Yes the webbing...
[mention]MsCowpea[/mention] I just call them spider mites, to me they are detested pests no matter the color. So, the russets do not web? In my garden I haven't seen webbing for the past 2 years, ever since I started that water blasting early prevention. I also water tomatoes from the top. Mind you everyone, before you say that's a no-no, I live in sunny dry So. CA so fungal or blight issues are less frequent here. I got the idea from the renown Huntington Library Rose garden curators. They're dealing with mites this way and whatever roses don't like this method they no longer have.
The tomatoes at my office garden got badly infected with mites once; the leaves were all yellow and brown just like in shrinkwraps pics so that is why I wondered why I couldn't see webbing. Because the office plants had fine beige webbing all over. I covered each in large bags and disposed of them. The next year I was retiring so I didn't plant there after that.
What type of mites were they if they webbed? I'd like to know thanks.
Zone 10, Southern California
Will eat anything once before I judge.
Anything meaning any foods of course.

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Re: So many things going wrong!

#13

Post: # 29614Unread post MsCowpea
Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:37 am

Peebee, I didn’t know if russet mites produced webbing or not , articles I was reading didn’t mention webbing in description so I was wondering about that.

Finally found this:
http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/GARDEN/VEGES/P ... smite.html

Apparently there are webbing spider mites and non-webbing ones. So you could still have mites even if you don’t see webbing.
“Don't confuse russet mites with spider mites, which are rounder and larger, usually have two spots, and often produce webbing.”

Wow, lots of mites.

http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/invertebrates/links.mites.html

Shrinkrap: That is a very frightening picture. Calif. is so beautiful and these fires are so destructive and dangerous. So Depressing.
All that ash would certainty effect plants.
"When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work."
Carl Huffaker

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Ginger2778
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#14

Post: # 29615Unread post Ginger2778
Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:52 am

Russet Mites do not produce webbing. Since the OP'sproblem is Spider Mites, there are other options to take care If them. TRMs don't respond to almost anything except abamectin, and I never spray it on flowers. It's a last resort. It's always good to be cautious and care for bees. We have a hive right now inside the Comcast equipment on my property..
- Marsha

Shrinkrap
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#15

Post: # 29635Unread post Shrinkrap
Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:06 am

That reminds me; about a month ago, I tried diatomaceous earth , and Monterey Insect Garden Spray (with Spinosad) about a week after that. i was trying to get rid of mites without killing the good guys and it was t o out for Neem Oil.

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Re: So many things going wrong!

#16

Post: # 29638Unread post MsCowpea
Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:34 am

I never knew there were russet mites in Florida. One thing after another —what’s next?

This says so far they have only been found on tomatoes.

https://ipm.ifas.ufl.edu/resources/succ ... t_Mite.pdf

They mention sulfur , I have read that you should never use sulfur and oil without a break between them.

Shrinkrap: I am always researching having chickens but never get any. Anyway They use diatomaceous earth on the chickens and coop
as it dehydrates the chicken mites. But russet mites appears to be in a class by themselves. Hope I never have to deal with them.
"When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work."
Carl Huffaker

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Ginger2778
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Re: Tomato Russet Mites

#17

Post: # 29641Unread post Ginger2778
Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:58 am

Yes, I bought a bunch of sulfur, but haven't used it. I've been afraid. And I never use oils, but sulfur can make your soil really acidic if you're not careful enough. Pete is already too low pH.
The mites are also on Cannabis.
They live in containers, but also get brought in on wind. And they get on your glove or shirt and rub off on the next Plant.
Telltale signs: yellowing starting from the area leaf where it meets the stem, radiating out from the main vein.
Stems losing their green color, getting browned.
Any spray runoff looking lime/stem green
Powdery/grainy feel to dead stems.
Not visible to the naked eye, need about 14X or larger magnification. They appear as little cones with 4 legs. I use my microscope for definitive ID.
- Marsha

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Re: So many things going wrong!

#18

Post: # 29662Unread post MsCowpea
Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:09 pm

Do you get that pinprick stippling on the leaves first? Or just yellowing?

If you are spraying earthbox with cover could you keep the sulfur from getting inside so the pH is not effected?
"When we kill off the natural enemies of a pest we inherit their work."
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Ginger2778
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#19

Post: # 29667Unread post Ginger2778
Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:59 pm

MsCowpea wrote: Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:09 pm Do you get that pinprick stippling on the leaves first? Or just yellowing?

If you are spraying earthbox with cover could you keep the sulfur from getting inside so the pH is not effected?
No stippled appearance with TRMs. Yellowing and bronzing. The infection is pretty far advanced by the time you see symptoms That stppling is pretty much THE telltale sign for spider mites. I fut some largish openings as I,plantvtgrough the covers. I think there would be a lot of drip runoff still going in, and you have to repeat a spray in about 4 days when you have insects, to get the newly hatched.
They aren't even the same type of insect as spider mites. Different classification. I've never seen South Florida spider mites infect my tomatoes,(cucumbers yes) but TRMs are almost every year.
- Marsha

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bower
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Re: So many things going wrong!

#20

Post: # 29678Unread post bower
Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:20 pm

Scary looking fire there! Hope you're safe from that for the season. :?
AgCan Zone 5a/USDA zone 4
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yearly precip 61 inches/1550 mm

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