Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

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GoDawgs
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Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#1

Post: # 28561Unread post GoDawgs
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:43 pm

I collected three sets of tomato seeds with juice on the 13th and now five days later there's still no mat of ferment funk on the top of the three glasses. This is the first time that's happened. Is it possible they've "quietly" fermented and I can go ahead and clean and dry them or should I wait longer? I'd appreciate your thoughts.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#2

Post: # 28565Unread post Bower
Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:13 pm

I would add a little water, swish and see if seeds are settling clean to the bottom. If so continue as usual!
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#3

Post: # 28568Unread post goodloe
Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:32 pm

Yup, I agree wit @Bower ...

I put about half an inch of filtered water in the glass, then add the seeds/juice/gel and cover with a napkin...They are usually good to go in 3-4 days.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#4

Post: # 28571Unread post Whwoz
Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:53 pm

Could also add some yeast to kick start the process
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#5

Post: # 28592Unread post GoDawgs
Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:36 am

Thanks for the comments! The seeds had sunk to the bottom so I went ahead with the rinses. I did German Johnson, SOTW and that Fake Annie (the yellow PL one that came out of a pack of red RL Early Annie seeds). What concerned me was that some of the German Johnsons had started sprouting! I carefully went through all the seeds as I separated them out on a plate, pulling out the sprouting ones. I've never had that happen either but it's no wonder since they sat in liquid for five days!
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#6

Post: # 28677Unread post Paquebot
Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:55 pm

Adding more water dilutes it and inhibits fermentation. Fermentation relies on sugar. Some varieties are very low Brix and will be very slow to ferment if water is added. I have had several this year that did not scum over but the seeds were still released from their gel. I generally add about 25% water no matter how juicy they are.

Sprouting after only 5 days is most unusual. I've forgotten some for twice that with no such problem. Temperature may be a factor if 90ºF or higher.

Martin

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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#7

Post: # 28710Unread post HL2601
Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:26 pm

Thanks for that info Martin, always great to learn new things here!
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#8

Post: # 28713Unread post Ginger2778
Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:52 pm

GoDawgs wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:43 pm
I collected three sets of tomato seeds with juice on the 13th and now five days later there's still no mat of ferment funk on the top of the three glasses. This is the first time that's happened. Is it possible they've "quietly" fermented and I can go ahead and clean and dry them or should I wait longer? I'd appreciate your thoughts.
It's very possible. Especially if there was a bit too much water added. See if you see a lot of seeds on the bottom, that'll tell you they are ready. Don't leave them too long in there!
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#9

Post: # 28714Unread post Ginger2778
Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:59 pm

Paquebot wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:55 pm
Adding more water dilutes it and inhibits fermentation. Fermentation relies on sugar. Some varieties are very low Brix and will be very slow to ferment if water is added. I have had several this year that did not scum over but the seeds were still released from their gel. I generally add about 25% water no matter how juicy they are.

Sprouting after only 5 days is most unusual. I've forgotten some for twice that with no such problem. Temperature may be a factor if 90ºF or higher.

Martin
5 days in a watery mix isn't so unusual to have sprouting. But right, adding too much water causes the appearance of the low ferment amount, but it actually does ferment. Then, because its wet and has cleaned away the gel, they sprout.
Dawgs- next time try not adding any extra water, just seeds with gel, and juice.
- Marsha

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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#10

Post: # 28754Unread post GoDawgs
Fri Aug 21, 2020 9:07 am

I appreciate all the input. However, no water had been added to the containers for the fermentation process. The seeds were in pure tomato liquid. That's why I was really puzzled. I have added very small amounts of water in the past when the tomato wasn't particularly juicy but still got a good mold mat. I will have to do a germination test on those German Johnsons.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#11

Post: # 29057Unread post Gardenboy
Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:08 am

How long do you leave your seeds to ferment?
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#12

Post: # 29064Unread post Ginger2778
Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:03 pm

I have often not gotten a fungal matt , but they are clean after 3 days anyway. The top sort of just looks milky/cloudy.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#13

Post: # 29782Unread post WoodSprite
Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:39 pm

I had the same problem and did a search to find answers and found this thread.

I collected Matina seeds and juice into a jar (without added water) on Aug. 19. No mold formed. Several days ago I added a little water. Today (15 days after collection) there was a little mold on top but not much. The seeds had settled to the bottom and the gel coats were gone so I cleaned them and have them on a plate to dry.

The reason for my search on this topic (besides the no mold) is that the seeds are very soft. I'm concerned I may have drowned them. Is it normal for them to be very soft after fermenting for the normal 5 days or less? Is there a way (besides trying to sprout some which I am doing now with papertowel & baggie) to visually tell if they are dead/drowned or still viable?

Just to be safe, I just collected more seeds & juice (they are very juicy) from a very ripe Matina and added a little water this time hoping that will speed the fermentation process.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#14

Post: # 29783Unread post EdieJ
Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:54 pm

Uh oh ... I soaked my seeds overnight in water, put them in a colander and gently scrubbed them under running water, then when it appeared there was no gel left I put them on paper towels to dry. Did I kill them? 😭
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#15

Post: # 29812Unread post Whwoz
Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:26 pm

No, but they may stick to the paper. If you choose to ferment, let them sit for 3 days before rinsing. The fermenting should remove all the gel.
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Re: Collected Tomato Seeds Not Fermenting...

#16

Post: # 30120Unread post JRinPA
Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:19 pm

Seems to work better for me when I add a splash of water. The times I don't, I must forget about them and they half dry up. I got some black seeds this year again from my first cup - Paul Robeson was the first ripe heirloom and I hope those brown seeds sprout if I ever decide to grow again.

@EdieJ Yes, that is a shame you killed your seeds. I suggest delaying the burial until you can prepare a proper send off in the spring. Then you can bury them 1/4" down into your memorial potting mix and sprinkle them with some holy water. Make sure to mark their grave though.

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