Crossing with Solanum habrochaites (another POV)

[Mark_Thompson]

So I was inspired by @Frosti, @bower as well as some reading I did on another forum (that won't let me join...) and by a paper by Brazilian scientists on Septoria Leaf Spot resistance in various Solanums, so I decided to try some crosses with S. habrochaites. Being a noob I used mostly potato leaf mothers so I would know rather quickly if my crosses took.

Well much to my surprise a few actually did. I'm fairly confident that I have F1's of Epstein's Potato Leaf, and Elgin Pink, and less confident but hopeful that I have Malachite Box. I'm definitely not committing to taking all three crosses into the high F's but I'll grow the F1's out and save seeds and then go from there. I have a long season (I guess infinitely long technically) so I have the calendar days to meddle a bit. Here goes nothing...

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[bower]

Those are great tomato parents, Mark. Fingers crossed for some promising F2's!
You might have to backcross to a tomato parent, to get away from the undesired fruit qualities. Something to keep in mind, grow some great tomato parents again, the year you're in F2's.
Or maybe it is worth making the backcross in F1? IDK, I've never crossed with the wild relatives. I think in the F2 you should get some fruit that are tomato-like at least, and then that would be the one to backcross, assuming the septoria resistance is present too.

[Tim DH]

Hi Mark,
Welcome to a whole new Aladdin’s Cave of dreams/possibilities!

The Potato Leaf Mother trick is neat isn’t it? Utilizing it has significantly upped my game.

Tim DH

[Mark_Thompson]

@bower I think I will grow out some F2s and see what kind of variation there is with my simple cross. But thank you for the advice re having some good mothers planted at that time, great idea.

[Mark_Thompson]

Very fun plant, big beautiful flowers and healthy foliage relative to the neighbors.

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[nicotomato]

Great !

What habrochaites parent did you use ?

[Mark_Thompson]

Thanks, I used habro as the pollen donor. I got the seeds from HR seeds.

[Frosti]

@Mark_Thompson, your plants are looking good! Did you also observe that the crossed fruit only contained very few seeds? And did those seeds look normal or were they very small and misshapen like mine?

[Mark_Thompson]

@Frosti I had lots of seeds, but they were small dark habrochaites looking seeds. Looking at yours and seeing mine were similar is what really gave me hope that the cross took. I’ve had super good germination though surprisingly.

[Mark_Thompson]

A couple F1 fruits from the Epstein’s PL cross. They are certainly bigger than pure habro, and ripen to green with a very faint pink blush. I’ll have to work up the courage to eat one soon.

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[Frosti]

those look very similar to mine. Let them ripen until they are yellowish. They'll taste a lot better then.

[Mark_Thompson]

Well I didn’t think the fruit was terrible, but the wifey actually called it “good” so that’s an awfully promising sign. Kind of at a crossroads now though, questioning whether to grow out a larger number of the F2, or just grow a few and then cross back to domestic tomatoes this generation.

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[Mark_Thompson]

Malachite Box x S habro F1 versus Epstein’s PL x S habro F1. Just a fun pic.

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[Mark_Thompson]

So I went ahead and crossed my crosses. So hopefully I’ve got some seeds that are 1/4 habrochaites, 3/4 domestics. I also planted some of the Epstein’s PL cross F2 out in the garden to see how those behave.

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[bower]

Excellent news! It'll be really interesting to see what the fruit are looking like after the backcross.

[Mark_Thompson]

I have around seven F2s growing. Varied in their color, leaf shape, and growth habit as one might expect. Here is a pic of two side by side. I understand that a bigger grow out would be better, but I don’t have infinite space or time so here we are. Also need to save some room for my 25% habros.

Related note, how do you rotate crops when all you want to do is grow tomatoes 365???

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[MissS]

Related note, how do you rotate crops when all you want to do is grow tomatoes 365???

Compost, compost and then some more compost. This recharges the bacteria, fungi and nutrients. Of course the addition of other organic nutrients would be quite beneficial.

[bower]

Patti is right about piling on the organic matter and nutrients (which I know you do anyway).
When you reach the point that there's a serious buildup of disease or pest, well... it's the perfect environment to select for resistance, right?!
WRT low numbers and small space - never underestimate the power of luck. Luck will move a project forward better than numbers where you don't have the luck. And if it doesn't work out and provide a selection you love, there's always next year - or next season for you. Especially if there's disease resistance potential to be chosen, keep that and if you're not wowed about the fruit, cross it again. JMO.

[Mark_Thompson]

So my domestic x habro F2s are pretty underwhelming. None of them will set fruit. I’m going to focus on the 3/4 domestic, 1/4 habro varieties.

I have the KBX cross going in a big pot, extremely vigorous regular leaf plant. I also have three potato leaves that I’ll be growing out.

Also growing four plants of the Domingo cross out in the garden. Interesting to see the diversity in flower shape as well as leaf types between seeds that were all popped out of the same fruit.

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[Frosti]

So my domestic x habro F2s are pretty underwhelming. None of them will set fruit. I’m going to focus on the 3/4 domestic, 1/4 habro varieties.

I have the KBX cross going in a big pot, extremely vigorous regular leaf plant. I also have three potato leaves that I’ll be growing out.

Also growing four plants of the Domingo cross out in the garden. Interesting to see the diversity in flower shape as well as leaf types between seeds that were all popped out of the same fruit.



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@Mark_Thompson, the almost no fruit set issue is exactly why I did not continue with my habrochaites line this year. I don't remember the exact number but I think it was like 3 plants out of 20 that actually set fruit reliably. What a bummer, right?