NEVER SAY NEVER

[Growing Coastal]

I found some 10 year old winter broad bean seeds I had saved. When I put them in the ground in Oct/Nov. I didn't really think they would grow being so old. I've read that bean seeds don't keep well.
I was surprised when I saw them up already but our weather has been mild lately. Only a few have come up, so far.





I also noticed that the elephant garlic is sprouting on the old flower heads as it does every winter. When they do this I scatter them where I want them. The seeds are still in the old flower husk which is black. When sprouted they fall off readily. I always leave some to bloom for hummingbirds to feed on, and they look nice mixed in with flowers.

[TLC333]

I think this is what I love most about growing. Some want to make it about rules and boundaries. If we let nature take its course.....it can surprise us. Will you grow out your beans and save more seeds? Are these old genetics?

[Growing Coastal]

I do plan on saving seeds if the plants come to fruition. Sometimes even when old seeds germinate the plants aren't strong.
I have no idea about the lineage of this bean and cannot find it when searching so, yes, maybe old genetics too. I hadn't thought about that. My seeds were saved from the garden after a few years of growing them so they've been around for a while.

[rxkeith]

beans, or i should say some beans have a fairly long shelf life.
i have some fava beans that are pretty old too. i'll say they are between
10 and 15 yrs old. germination was still above 50% when i planted them
a couple years ago. a seed not planted is guaranteed not to grow.
i also have pole bean seeds several years old i sometimes forget about that
give decent germination, and growth. some other bush beans i have had
germinated poorly when just a few years old.



keith

[bower]

Having seeds that can still germinate years later is a great trait, as far as I'm concerned. Great idea to save these and keep growing em! You never know if the day may come when you're so glad to plant that ol seed from the back of the cupboard and get a plant!!

[Shule]

…
I also noticed that the elephant garlic is sprouting on the old flower heads as it does every winter. When they do this I scatter them where I want them. The seeds are still in the old flower husk which is black. When sprouted they fall off readily. I always leave some to bloom for hummingbirds to feed on, and they look nice mixed in with flowers.

You just answered a longstanding question I've had: Does elephant garlic have seeds (as leeks do) or bulbils in the flowerheads (as garlic does)? Looks like it has seeds. It's a shame no one's selling seeds (to my knowledge).

[rxkeith]

elephant garlic is a misnomer.
it is in the leek family, so i would expect it to have seeds.
growing elephant garlic from seed might be a multi year process
before you get those large cloves. many gardeners may not want to
wait that long to harvest full size bulbs. i have not grown elephant
garlic, only garlic garlic.

keith

[MrBig46]

…
I also noticed that the elephant garlic is sprouting on the old flower heads as it does every winter. When they do this I scatter them where I want them. The seeds are still in the old flower husk which is black. When sprouted they fall off readily. I always leave some to bloom for hummingbirds to feed on, and they look nice mixed in with flowers.

You just answered a longstanding question I've had: Does elephant garlic have seeds (as leeks do) or bulbils in the flowerheads (as garlic does)? Looks like it has seeds. It's a shame no one's selling seeds (to my knowledge).

I'm also interested in the elephant garlic. What does it look like and taste like normal garlic? I've read about it many times on Tomatoville, but it never occurred to me that it could be grown from seed, which would probably be the only option for me.
Vladimír

[Whwoz]

Elephant garlic, or Allium ampeloprasum, is like a mild garlic. It is actually closer to a leek, but garlic flavoured. Generally 5 or 6 cloves per bulb, but can form large rounds, indeed some clones seem to alternate between rounds one year and cloves the next. Often will have "bulbils" up to one centimetre across around the outside of a clove. Most strains flower readily, but do not always set seed. Flowering does not reduce bulb size, as it can do with most garlic. I have attached a couple of photos showing bulbils and size of largest bulb last season, tag is 125mm long overall. This particular clone can get upto 15cm across.

Johnston Creek Garleek.jpg

Johnston Creek garleek 2.jpg

[Growing Coastal]

…
I also noticed that the elephant garlic is sprouting on the old flower heads as it does every winter. When they do this I scatter them where I want them. The seeds are still in the old flower husk which is black. When sprouted they fall off readily. I always leave some to bloom for hummingbirds to feed on, and they look nice mixed in with flowers.

You just answered a longstanding question I've had: Does elephant garlic have seeds (as leeks do) or bulbils in the flowerheads (as garlic does)? Looks like it has seeds. It's a shame no one's selling seeds (to my knowledge).

I'm also interested in the elephant garlic. What does it look like and taste like normal garlic? I've read about it many times on Tomatoville, but it never occurred to me that it could be grown from seed, which would probably be the only option for me.
Vladimír

For many years I thought it was leeks in the garden growing wild while I worked mostly ignoring the garden. At one point I did have both.
Turned out to be Elephant Garleek!
Some say it is not a true garlic but rather, a leek. Others say the opposite.
Whichever, it grows freely once established.
I did try to take seeds from what appeared to be a mature head in the fall last year. There were a few but not nearly as many as I would expect. Maybe they take longer to mature than I thought? I haven't tried starting any so I don't know if they are viable.

[bower]

I think they would be similar to other leeks - you have to wait at minimum until pods are clearly formed and plump, and ideally if there is time to mature on the plant, you wait to harvest like other alliums, when you see the pods are starting to open and the happy glint of a black seed waiting to tumble out. If they were looking that mature, maybe some seeds had already sprinkled out?
My season is often too short to mature leek seeds in the field by any means, not to mention turning wet! But if they can get to the stage of forming good pods, I can cut the stem about a foot long, and put the whole thing upsidedown in a paper bag, and hang it for a long time, couple of months before they will dry down, but you do get viable seeds eventually if the pods were mature enough, not so many if they were just starting.
One thing I noticed, it is easier to get the seeds out when the pods matured on the plant and were ready to split open. The ones that matured and dried slowly in a bag don't always split open as easily, so it's more of a job to remove the chaff.

The seeds that stayed out on the heads sure look viable! Very cool look, the gar-leek with a green head of hair.

I've never even tasted elephant garlic.. rarely seen in the supermarket, at prices some prince would pay . Must be good stuff..
If you do manage to save a head of seeds some year, put me on your list of eager swappers.

[Shule]

…
Turned out to be Elephant Garleek!
Some say it is not a true garlic but rather, a leek. Others say the opposite.
…

This might clear up the Allium relations a little:
* Garlic is Allium sativum
* Leeks are Allium ampeloprasum, Leek Group
* Elephant garlic is Allium ampeloprasum var. ampeloprasum
* Pearl onions are Allium ampeloprasum var. sectivum
* Wild leeks are Allium ampeloprasum
* Potato onions and shallots are Allium cepa var. aggregatum
* Regular onions and some bunching onions are Allium cepa
* Welsh onions and many bunching onions are Allium fistulosum
* Chives are Allium schoenoprasum
* Garlic chives are Allium tuberosum
* Egyptian walking onions are said to be a cross between Allium cepa and Allium fistulosum, but I don't think we know for sure
* Chinese onions are Allium chinense

There might be updates to this data, as I gathered it many months ago.

[MrBig46]

I think they would be similar to other leeks - you have to wait at minimum until pods are clearly formed and plump, and ideally if there is time to mature on the plant, you wait to harvest like other alliums, when you see the pods are starting to open and the happy glint of a black seed waiting to tumble out. If they were looking that mature, maybe some seeds had already sprinkled out?
My season is often too short to mature leek seeds in the field by any means, not to mention turning wet! But if they can get to the stage of forming good pods, I can cut the stem about a foot long, and put the whole thing upsidedown in a paper bag, and hang it for a long time, couple of months before they will dry down, but you do get viable seeds eventually if the pods were mature enough, not so many if they were just starting.
One thing I noticed, it is easier to get the seeds out when the pods matured on the plant and were ready to split open. The ones that matured and dried slowly in a bag don't always split open as easily, so it's more of a job to remove the chaff.

The seeds that stayed out on the heads sure look viable! Very cool look, the gar-leek with a green head of hair.

I've never even tasted elephant garlic.. rarely seen in the supermarket, at prices some prince would pay . Must be good stuff..
If you do manage to save a head of seeds some year, put me on your list of eager swappers.

I would also like to try sometime in the future.
Vladimír

[Whwoz]

Think of the taste of garlic without the heat burst at the start. Could easily be mistaken for some of the milder garlic, but cloves can be upto 4 cm across and rounds to 6 cm.

[Growing Coastal]

Recently a friend whose husband now grows EG told me she sliced up a large round and used them on sandwiches. Mild and delicious she said.

[MrBig46]

I started to wonder where I could get cloves of elephant garlic. Surprisingly, the only farm that sells this garlic for planting is in the small village where my friend lives (coincidence). One clove costs 50 crowns, one pacibulka 10 crowns. It's quite expensive, I have to decide what to buy. I still have to consult with that friend. When is elephant garlic planted?
Vladimír

[Whwoz]

I plant mine with the turban garlic, around March in the Southern hemisphere, not sure for you

[Growing Coastal]

I started to wonder where I could get cloves of elephant garlic. Surprisingly, the only farm that sells this garlic for planting is in the small village where my friend lives (coincidence). One clove costs 50 crowns, one pacibulka 10 crowns. It's quite expensive, I have to decide what to buy. I still have to consult with that friend. When is elephant garlic planted?
Vladimír

It is planted at the same time as regular garlic, in the fall. When I leave the smaller plants in the garden they die back over summer and re emerge in the late fall/winter. Same if I dig them out and put them in a pot. Then I can plant the rounds where I want them in autumn.

[MrBig46]

If they're betting in the fall, it's too late now. I guess I'll have to give it up.
Vladimír

[MrBig46]

Elephant garlic, or Allium ampeloprasum, is like a mild garlic. It is actually closer to a leek, but garlic flavoured. Generally 5 or 6 cloves per bulb, but can form large rounds, indeed some clones seem to alternate between rounds one year and cloves the next. Often will have "bulbils" up to one centimetre across around the outside of a clove. Most strains flower readily, but do not always set seed. Flowering does not reduce bulb size, as it can do with most garlic. I have attached a couple of photos showing bulbils and size of largest bulb last season, tag is 125mm long overall. This particular clone can get upto 15cm across.

Johnston Creek Garleek.jpg
Johnston Creek garleek 2.jpg

Have you ever tried to grow them from the seeds of that flower?
Vladimír