2020 MMMM variety questions & maybe answers

[rdback]

....and this bean which appears to be really old:
PI 309889 1987 (Costa Rica)

Looks like it's a runner bean. Not much info, but there is a pic which might help confirm you have PI 309889. Good luck with it!

https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal ... id=1231293

[BettyC-5]

....and this bean which appears to be really old:
PI 309889 1987 (Costa Rica)

Looks like it's a runner bean. Not much info, but there is a pic which might help confirm you have PI 309889. Good luck with it!

https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal ... id=1231293

Thank you, they do look like the little brown beans in the photo.
And, Tormato, I did find that one tomato

[HL2601]

A few questions-if anyone has any info

Turkey Creek
Spudleaf 117
and also Tormato's SNFLA x BKX is that an F3 or and F7? My eyes are playing tricks on me!
Thanks,
Heide

[OhioGardener]

I don't find any information on these tomatoes:
Saraev Suetlaplodni

Saraev Svetloplodnye was my submission. "Svetloplodnye" translates to light-fruited and it's one of the cold tolerant selections of Russian scientist PY Saraev who bred for light frost tolerance in the seedlings though this is said to be an epigenetic trait that requires conditioning from generation to generation. It is otherwise a nice tomato. A medium-sized light red slicer with a good sweet flavor. My bushes were loaded and it seems to have some keeping qualities as it will last much longer than many heirlooms after picking. My original seed source for this one was Tatiana's tomatobase: http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Saraev_Svetloplodnye

Also, I saw Premus mentioned by another poster. It's an ultra-early, compact, 14-16 inch dwarf of Soviet breeding with 2 inch red fruit that I've been maintaining for the last 30 years and would be happy to answer any questions either here or via PM.

[HL2601]

SO glad to see your post Debbie. I have Premus growing right now! I know you got it in Russia-was it from a market? Did you get to see the whole plant or just the tomatoes to save the seed?
Heide

[OhioGardener]

SO glad to see your post Debbie. I have Premus growing right now! I know you got it in Russia-was it from a market? Did you get to see the whole plant or just the tomatoes to save the seed?
Heide

I didn't get to see the plant until I grew it myself. The person who gave Premus to me along with Chernyi Prins (Black Prince - Premus 1993 strain) was a former Soviet Biologist from Minsk who traveled to meet me in the dorm of Pushkin's Institute for Russian Language when I was there for summer/fall lessons. She'd been corresponding with one of my biology professors in the US. I still have her handwritten letter that she gave me with the seeds, although originally she'd apparently mailed Chernyi Prins and a red pepper which I never received. No surprise though because the ex-Soviet economy and systems were badly in disarray then and I remember post offices not even having stamps when we tried to send letters back to our families. When Tatiana met me in person though, she gave me Chernyi Prins and Premus without its original name. I do remember her saying it was from Leningrad (now St. Petersburg) and was bred for balconies or low tunnel agriculture. It may have come from a university in the former USSR, but I can't remember what else she may have said. I can say that it's been very uniform, consistently one of the earliest, and puts out a shocking number of surprisingly good tasting 2" tomatoes for such a small plant. Over the last decade, I've been trying to grow out a whole bunch of named Russian tree stem dwarfs available here to see if I can find anything that matches and so far I haven't. It also seems that most modern Russian seed vendors are selling mostly American and European varieties with many of the old Soviet types falling out of interest. So Premus, or whatever it's name originally was, may have been lost in Russia in that era. As an interesting aside, I still have some old letters from a few of my Pushkin classmates of that era. One was a Korean student studying Russian who wanted to become a journalist. Several days after I left with my tomato seeds, she sent a letter to me in the US about her personal experience witnessing the events on the street during the 1993 Constitutional Crisis where tanks were firing on the Russian White House just a few miles from our dorm. I was still pretty young at the time and the scary political instability more or less ended my interest in studying there, so that was the last time I visited Russia. Those were the first few years when they were struggling to shake off 70 years of socialism. Now it's sad for me to see them slipping back into another manifestation of authoritarianism. But alas, that's the story of how "Premus" came to be.

Premus8.jpg

Premus2.jpg

Premus17.jpg

[steve ok]

Any difference in Premus if grown in a bed or in a pot?

[HL2601]

Woah- thank you so much for your detailed story! I love growing tomatoes with a history and this one certainly has that. Plus, the leaves on Premus are incredible! Way bigger than anything I have that ranges 14-16". I am excited to watch it grow.

And what happened with Black Prince- Chernyi Prins?
Thank you so much for sharing this with all of us. I hope others will grow it too!

[OhioGardener]

And what happened with Black Prince- Chernyi Prins?
Thank you so much for sharing this with all of us. I hope others will grow it too!

Chernyi Prins is alive and well. The strain is different than the "Black Prince" being a large beefsteak with a sweeter more complex flavor. I have a good amount of seed for swap or it may find it's way into next year's Mmmm. I also have 4 tomatoes, a pumpkin, zucchini, and a cucumber from my friend's mom in Moscow from 1991 and one that I picked up in an open air market. The cucurbits in particular are old Soviet varieties and match the Belorussian agriculture register as open-pollinated varieties available during that era, not the hybrids currently sold under the same name or in one case not even the same squash species. I did a big grow out this year and am also looking at donating these to the SSE collection, so they're alive and well also.

[OhioGardener]

Any difference in Premus if grown in a bed or in a pot?

Not much, but I think production in the ground is a bit higher and there's less of a chance of BER in the first fruit. I wouldn't call this variety particularly susceptible, but being that it's such an ultra early and heavy setter, some of the first container fruits can have BER if the soil is deficient in calcium or it gets leached out with a lot of rain. The attached photos are in-ground plants where you can see they still don't take up much space.

[Gabby1]

A few questions-if anyone has any info

Turkey Creek
Spudleaf 117
and also Tormato's SNFLA x BKX is that an F3 or and F7? My eyes are playing tricks on me!
Thanks,
Heide

Turkey Creek.80 days Ind.Rl Huge pink slicers. From Know Co.Ky. Gillenwater family. Last member passed in 1963. Nellie Hawn obtained seeds around 1958. Grown by the Hawn and Kris Hubbard family. I have grown for 2 years and are a must grow.

[Tormahto]

Spudleaf 117 is the PL version of Russian #117.

[NarnianGarden]

And what happened with Black Prince- Chernyi Prins?
Thank you so much for sharing this with all of us. I hope others will grow it too!

Chernyi Prins is alive and well. The strain is different than the "Black Prince" being a large beefsteak with a sweeter more complex flavor. I have a good amount of seed for swap or it may find it's way into next year's Mmmm. I also have 4 tomatoes, a pumpkin, zucchini, and a cucumber from my friend's mom in Moscow from 1991 and one that I picked up in an open air market. The cucurbits in particular are old Soviet varieties and match the Belorussian agriculture register as open-pollinated varieties available during that era, not the hybrids currently sold under the same name or in one case not even the same squash species. I did a big grow out this year and am also looking at donating these to the SSE collection, so they're alive and well also.

Fascinating to hearof your memories! By the way, the attempted 'putsch' was also in 1991... I remember it well.

Do you still speak Russian / practice it?

I happen to have some Black prince seeds from a swap, as well as some Chernyi prins, purchased from Russia ... I had no idea there could be difference already.

[OhioGardener]

Fascinating to hear of your memories! By the way, the attempted 'putsch' was also in 1991... I remember it well.

Do you still speak Russian / practice it?

I happen to have some Black prince seeds from a swap, as well as some Chernyi prins, purchased from Russia ... I had no idea there could be difference already.

I do read and speak a little Russian. Just by coincidence I was actually in Moscow visiting for the first time just before the failed coup of 1991 when it was still USSR and then again in 1993 and brought back tomatoes both times. For me, tomatoes will always be more interesting than politics .

[OhioGardener]

Here are a few that I'm looking for information and history on:

Antonucci Slicer
Brutus - I've found a Brutus Magnum and a Brutus F1 and am wondering which is it? Or is it different?
Chokomato
Yuvel

[Rockoe10]

Antonucci Slicer is an Indeterminate, Regular Leaf plant that, when in full fruit production, tends to drastically slow it's growth. For this reason, I'd consider it a Semi-Determinate. The fruit are red and consistently over a pound, and even with the terrible tomato season last year, my largest tomato was 1lb 12.6oz. It can reach over 2lbs. The shape is globe-ish with slight ribs. Seldomly, there will be some odd shaped tomatoes, but this is the exception. The taste is your average tomato.

I received the seeds from my grandfather. He is having trouble getting out in the garden now in his old age and asked if I would grow them. He served in World War II and a Polishman gave my grandfather seeds from Italy. For several decades, my grandfather has grown these Tomatoes and selected seeds from the largest tomato. Its acclamated for Western PA soil in US Zone 6.

PS
Antonucci Slicer is the largest tomato at the front in my profile picture. The beefsteak tomatoes behind it are Mortgage Lifters. That should give you an idea of shape and size. It was picked very early due to pests. It would have gotten bigger for sure and more red.

[OhioGardener]

Antonucci Slicer is an Indeterminate, Regular Leaf plant that, when in full fruit production, tends to drastically slow it's growth. For this reason, I'd consider it a Semi-Determinate. The fruit are red and consistently over a pound, and even with the terrible tomato season last year, my largest tomato was 1lb 12.6oz. It can reach over 2lbs. The shape is globe-ish with slight ribs. Seldomly, there will be some odd shaped tomatoes, but this is the exception. The taste is your average tomato.

I received the seeds from my grandfather. He is having trouble getting out in the garden now in his old age and asked if I would grow them. He served in World War II and a Polishman gave my grandfather seeds from Italy. For several decades, my grandfather has grown these Tomatoes and selected seeds from the largest tomato. Its acclamated for Western PA soil in US Zone 6.

PS
Antonucci Slicer is the largest tomato at the front in my profile picture. The beefsteak tomatoes behind it are Mortgage Lifters. That should give you an idea of shape and size. It was picked very early due to pests. It would have gotten bigger for sure and more red.

Wonderful history. Thank you. Would you mind sharing your grandfather's name so that I can include it in my notes for his tomato?

[Rockoe10]

Antonucci Slicer is an Indeterminate, Regular Leaf plant that, when in full fruit production, tends to drastically slow it's growth. For this reason, I'd consider it a Semi-Determinate. The fruit are red and consistently over a pound, and even with the terrible tomato season last year, my largest tomato was 1lb 12.6oz. It can reach over 2lbs. The shape is globe-ish with slight ribs. Seldomly, there will be some odd shaped tomatoes, but this is the exception. The taste is your average tomato.

I received the seeds from my grandfather. He is having trouble getting out in the garden now in his old age and asked if I would grow them. He served in World War II and a Polishman gave my grandfather seeds from Italy. For several decades, my grandfather has grown these Tomatoes and selected seeds from the largest tomato. Its acclamated for Western PA soil in US Zone 6.

PS
Antonucci Slicer is the largest tomato at the front in my profile picture. The beefsteak tomatoes behind it are Mortgage Lifters. That should give you an idea of shape and size. It was picked very early due to pests. It would have gotten bigger for sure and more red.

Wonderful history. Thank you. Would you mind sharing your grandfather's name so that I can include it in my notes for his tomato?

Of course,
Robert "Tony" Antonucci. There were a lot of Roberts where he worked, so he goes by his middle name. I know the pain, cuz I've always been given a nick name everywhere i go. Usually based on my last name .

[habitat-gardener]

I've grown Brutus a few times, since at least 2016 or 2107. It appears to be an OP large red tomato with great taste. IIRC, I got the seeds from Marsha (ginger2778) in one of her annual seed offers. I looked on Tatiana's tomato base, where the original source is listed as Moravoseed. http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Brutus

[MissS]

Yuvel' is a regular leafed red tomato. 12-20 oz. mid-season. Meaty with wonderful flavor.